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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Nature is the new poor.&#8221;</title>
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		<title>By: OMG</title>
		<link>http://omgcenter.com/2010/06/nature-is-the-new-poor/comment-page-1/#comment-90</link>
		<dc:creator>OMG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jun 2010 01:51:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I like this comment a lot.  I&#039;m very intrigued by the notion of paradise being relationship...all too often I think it is spiritualized, a destination to get to, rather than one to live out.  You now have given me another book to read.

I do believe that there is &lt;em&gt;relatively&lt;/em&gt; little in the NT, compared with the OT, using land as a sacred reference point.  Elsewhere Kaufman, whom I quoted above, notes that it is not a surprise that the early church gravitated toward the notion of &quot;kingdom&quot; rather than something more organic, more material.  

I bet you that sacramental theology might step up to the plate here, however.  

And, as Steve Matzner pointed out in last night&#039;s forum, there is no shortage of agricultural references; mustard seeds, vineyards, sowing, and so forth.  

My sense of Brueggeman&#039;s notion of space is more a notion of &quot;irrelevant space,&quot; or &quot;amassed space.&quot;  Space becomes a commodity and a selfish possession, disconnected from history and relationship.  I am reminded of his book &lt;em&gt;Israel&#039;s Praise&lt;/em&gt;, in which he points out his dislike of Psalms full of unanchored praise--like 150.  His critique here gave me fodder to critique &quot;contemporary creeds,&quot; creeds which are meant to do the same thing as the Nicene or the Apostles, but don&#039;t.  They don&#039;t, because they have no shared and spanned history, no anchor in anything but the immediate moment.  

I digress.

Now.  Off to purchase &lt;em&gt;Saving Paradise&lt;/em&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like this comment a lot.  I&#8217;m very intrigued by the notion of paradise being relationship&#8230;all too often I think it is spiritualized, a destination to get to, rather than one to live out.  You now have given me another book to read.</p>
<p>I do believe that there is <em>relatively</em> little in the NT, compared with the OT, using land as a sacred reference point.  Elsewhere Kaufman, whom I quoted above, notes that it is not a surprise that the early church gravitated toward the notion of &#8220;kingdom&#8221; rather than something more organic, more material.  </p>
<p>I bet you that sacramental theology might step up to the plate here, however.  </p>
<p>And, as Steve Matzner pointed out in last night&#8217;s forum, there is no shortage of agricultural references; mustard seeds, vineyards, sowing, and so forth.  </p>
<p>My sense of Brueggeman&#8217;s notion of space is more a notion of &#8220;irrelevant space,&#8221; or &#8220;amassed space.&#8221;  Space becomes a commodity and a selfish possession, disconnected from history and relationship.  I am reminded of his book <em>Israel&#8217;s Praise</em>, in which he points out his dislike of Psalms full of unanchored praise&#8211;like 150.  His critique here gave me fodder to critique &#8220;contemporary creeds,&#8221; creeds which are meant to do the same thing as the Nicene or the Apostles, but don&#8217;t.  They don&#8217;t, because they have no shared and spanned history, no anchor in anything but the immediate moment.  </p>
<p>I digress.</p>
<p>Now.  Off to purchase <em>Saving Paradise</em>.</p>
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		<title>By: Kirsten Mebust</title>
		<link>http://omgcenter.com/2010/06/nature-is-the-new-poor/comment-page-1/#comment-89</link>
		<dc:creator>Kirsten Mebust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jun 2010 16:03:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>So many of the early Christians were &quot;displaced,&quot; city-dwellers, not only dislocated by the exile and return but people who experienced rejection from their neighbors or who travelled for their faith (like Paul) that I think even Brueggeman&#039;s articulation of space would have to be a reach for them.  But paradise was vividly real as the place they did have, and not only proleptically.  Although it leaves some things to be desired from a Lutheran point of view, Rita Brock and Rebecca Parker&#039;s SAVING PARADISE gives us provocative clues about how paradise as a relationship among the Christian communities, the martyrs, the natural world, and God was the foundation of the art, architecture, and ethics of early Christianity.  It may be our readings of the NT that are inadequate, not the scriptures themselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So many of the early Christians were &#8220;displaced,&#8221; city-dwellers, not only dislocated by the exile and return but people who experienced rejection from their neighbors or who travelled for their faith (like Paul) that I think even Brueggeman&#8217;s articulation of space would have to be a reach for them.  But paradise was vividly real as the place they did have, and not only proleptically.  Although it leaves some things to be desired from a Lutheran point of view, Rita Brock and Rebecca Parker&#8217;s SAVING PARADISE gives us provocative clues about how paradise as a relationship among the Christian communities, the martyrs, the natural world, and God was the foundation of the art, architecture, and ethics of early Christianity.  It may be our readings of the NT that are inadequate, not the scriptures themselves.</p>
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